catshadow
Clean Shaven
Posts: 193
Byond Username: Catshadow
Job: Chief Engineer
Antagonist: Crewmember
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Post by catshadow on Sept 7, 2015 0:21:05 GMT
Brutalizing and torturing a cuffed prisioner as warden.
Really now indy, I'm rather tired of your shit.
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Post by Girdo on Sept 7, 2015 0:24:42 GMT
I believe this is legal, actually. I have several encounters with a certain Sereath Izzard to prove it.
Breaking a prisoner's feet and legs while bucklecuffed in the brig is unethical, but not really against the rules.
Granted, circumstances do matter. Torture isn't something you use when someone trespasses or steals the Chef's freshly baked pie. Perhaps you could elaborate on the incident in question?
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catshadow
Clean Shaven
Posts: 193
Byond Username: Catshadow
Job: Chief Engineer
Antagonist: Crewmember
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Post by catshadow on Sept 7, 2015 0:28:05 GMT
I believe this is legal, actually. I have several encounters with a certain Sereath Izzard to prove it. Breaking a prisoner's feet and legs while bucklecuffed in the brig is unethical, but not really against the rules. Granted, circumstances do matter. Torture isn't something you use when someone trespasses or steals the Chef's freshly baked pie. Perhaps you could elaborate on the incident in question? According to indy, possessing a stun revolver and "copying" a NT logo.
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Post by Girdo on Sept 7, 2015 0:54:33 GMT
Alright, tortured for having a stun revolver and... Copying a NT logo? Wut?
I'll need more information, but we're getting somewhere.
What was your job? How did you get a stun revolver? Exactly how and why were you arrested? Where did the claim of "copying" a NT logo come from? What was the extent of this torture?
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catshadow
Clean Shaven
Posts: 193
Byond Username: Catshadow
Job: Chief Engineer
Antagonist: Crewmember
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Post by catshadow on Sept 7, 2015 1:10:05 GMT
Alright, tortured for having a stun revolver and... Copying a NT logo? Wut? I'll need more information, but we're getting somewhere. What was your job? How did you get a stun revolver? Exactly how and why were you arrested? Where did the claim of "copying" a NT logo come from? What was the extent of this torture? RD/tator. Where do you fucking think, stun revolvers only come from one place. By a security officer with a flash. Attempting to subdue that security officer to maintain traitory secret with said stun revolver. A fake paper I made with the forgery kit. Some stabbing and then I logged off.
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Post by Girdo on Sept 7, 2015 4:38:43 GMT
FYI, Stun revolvers can spawn in the Armory. You could've been HoS/Warden.
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Post by RadiantFlash on Sept 7, 2015 4:55:18 GMT
Brutalizing and torturing a cuffed prisioner as warden. Really now indy, I'm rather tired of your shit. The warden got a direct order not to do it from the HOS. Honestly, when that happens, it's just pretty griefy. Alright, tortured for having a stun revolver and... Copying a NT logo? Wut? I'll need more information, but we're getting somewhere. What was your job? How did you get a stun revolver? Exactly how and why were you arrested? Where did the claim of "copying" a NT logo come from? What was the extent of this torture? RD/tator. Where do you fucking think, stun revolvers only come from one place. By a security officer with a flash. Attempting to subdue that security officer to maintain traitory secret with said stun revolver. A fake paper I made with the forgery kit. Some stabbing and then I logged off. You also forgot kidknapping the HoP, and that the fake paper had a seal of central command on it. Of course, that doesn't condone torture at all. I believe this is legal, actually. I have several encounters with a certain Sereath Izzard to prove it. Breaking a prisoner's feet and legs while bucklecuffed in the brig is unethical, but not really against the rules. Granted, circumstances do matter. Torture isn't something you use when someone trespasses or steals the Chef's freshly baked pie. Perhaps you could elaborate on the incident in question? In my defence, that round Sereath had gotten almost killed quite a few times, ended up in several trips to the medbay, and while there, If I'm correct, I believe you broke out while Sereath was away. So, It was intended to prevent you from escaping again. But, that was only one round? The only other time I've done that, was once as a captain, with similar circumstances. Could you point out the other times?
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Post by Girdo on Sept 7, 2015 6:50:22 GMT
When I attempted to press for information earlier, THIS was one of the key points I wanted. Violating a direct order is a no-no.
And as for Sereath... It's only happened about three times (hence, several instead of "a lot"). There's the incident you can recall, an incident where I attempted to poison someone's food and failed miserably, and an incident where I had to steal a jumpsuit or something. The first two, I was admittedly making a nuisance of myself, but for that last one, I was pretending to be innocent and causing a fuss, so you... "broke my legs so I couldn't escape." And then you left to do... Something?... With me in crit in the solitary confinement cell.
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Post by Geode McKuster on Sept 7, 2015 13:14:51 GMT
I do believe that Indy was under the impression that the Stun Revolver was a lethal revolver. I don't believe that they ever saw the revolver in question, as well as I believe the HoS mentioned the Revolver with also clarifying it was a /Stun/ Revolver. Which, in turn, I think I remember seeing Indy explain with something akin to the following: "I thought it was a revolver, which either they stole from the armory, or snuck aboard for nefarious purposes."
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Post by RadiantFlash on Sept 7, 2015 14:18:08 GMT
When I attempted to press for information earlier, THIS was one of the key points I wanted. Violating a direct order is a no-no. And as for Sereath... It's only happened about three times (hence, several instead of "a lot"). There's the incident you can recall, an incident where I attempted to poison someone's food and failed miserably, and an incident where I had to steal a jumpsuit or something. The first two, I was admittedly making a nuisance of myself, but for that last one, I was pretending to be innocent and causing a fuss, so you... "broke my legs so I couldn't escape." And then you left to do... Something?... With me in crit in the solitary confinement cell. I can't remember thr second time, but I sort of have vague recolectiob of the third.
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catshadow
Clean Shaven
Posts: 193
Byond Username: Catshadow
Job: Chief Engineer
Antagonist: Crewmember
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Post by catshadow on Sept 7, 2015 15:07:05 GMT
I'm not as mad as Inwas at indy yesterday. But I still want an admin to smack him on the wrists or something equivalent.
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Post by indy4321 on Sept 7, 2015 22:25:42 GMT
Alright, let em try explaining this. The HoS had told over the Security radio that you had a revolver and had forged an NT stamp. If he told us that it was a stun revolver and not an actual revolver, then it wasn't over the Security channel or somehow I didn't hear it. The officer that was trying to arrest you had called for help from the HoS, as well. To me, it sounded like you had either broken into the armory and opened a locker that requires HoS access to open to steal the revolver, or that you had somehow smuggled the revolver in, and then used it to try to escape from the Security Officer. Combined with forging an NT stamp, these did not seem like the actions of a petty criminal. Thus, during the interrogation, I was harsher than usual. You were purposely avoiding the subject, and were speaking in Tajaran and Unathi. Pepper spray and trivial sources of pain such as that didn't seem to work, so I opted for a semi-trivial injury, cutting you and bandaging it so you wouldn't bleed out, to show that I meant business. You didn't really react to the pain, so I stepped it up suddenly, breaking bones in the hopes of shocking you into submission. I think it was at this point that you logged off.
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cebutris
Cebutris
Spaaaaaaaaaaaaace
Posts: 221
Job: Chef
Antagonist: Ninja
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Post by cebutris on Sept 7, 2015 22:41:45 GMT
There should be no need for any type of torture. They could have killed three people and literally eaten their bodies, but there is still no need for torture. Sec's job is to capture and contain them, not punish them.
The only exception to this would be if the Captain or HoS expressly tells you to torture them, which they really shouldn't do ANYWAY.
Edit: There's also the fact that Indy was told NOT to torture the prisoner
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catshadow
Clean Shaven
Posts: 193
Byond Username: Catshadow
Job: Chief Engineer
Antagonist: Crewmember
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Post by catshadow on Sept 8, 2015 1:15:15 GMT
Alright, let em try explaining this. The HoS had told over the Security radio that you had a revolver and had forged an NT stamp. If he told us that it was a stun revolver and not an actual revolver, then it wasn't over the Security channel or somehow I didn't hear it. The officer that was trying to arrest you had called for help from the HoS, as well. To me, it sounded like you had either broken into the armory and opened a locker that requires HoS access to open to steal the revolver, or that you had somehow smuggled the revolver in, and then used it to try to escape from the Security Officer. Combined with forging an NT stamp, these did not seem like the actions of a petty criminal. Thus, during the interrogation, I was harsher than usual. You were purposely avoiding the subject, and were speaking in Tajaran and Unathi. Pepper spray and trivial sources of pain such as that didn't seem to work, so I opted for a semi-trivial injury, cutting you and bandaging it so you wouldn't bleed out, to show that I meant business. You didn't really react to the pain, so I stepped it up suddenly, breaking bones in the hopes of shocking you into submission. I think it was at this point that you logged off. Alright so: Forged a stamp- This isn't even a crime in space law to my knowledge, it's a RP law and even then, I'm not certain if the HoS actually contacted CC to see if it was fake or not. Etheir way it's at most a fine/brigging and a watching closely. Possessing a gun? Unless you had factual evidence otherwise it was at worst contraband, assuming otherwise isn't your job as warden, your not the detective. Kidnapping is a major crime but unless I killed the person or harmed them it's a twenty minute brigging or whatever. That's also ignoring that you removed my radio (illegal according to my memories of the security guide) without reason, and when you were trying to torture me you shut off my suit sensors (which were on max) after the CMO announced to turn them on. Hm that doesn't sound greify at all, wouldn't want the medbay staff to see you butchering a cuffed prisioner would you. Here's a direct quote from the first sentences of the Warden wiki page: "Half of your job is to look after the prisoners; make sure they aren't abused or given unfair sentences and that they don't escape." Your job is not to enforce justice, not to execute people, not to interrogate or torture them. Your job is to put them in prision clothes, and throw them and their ID and radio in the brig for whatever time provided for their stated crimes and make sure people aren't beating them. Your actions were completely out of character for the warden and completely unfitting of anyone playing security. I promptly demand you be job banned from security till you get your shenanigans together and stop acting like a fool in one of the most serious departments.
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Post by RadiantFlash on Sept 8, 2015 4:09:30 GMT
Alright so: Forged a stamp- This isn't even a crime in space law to my knowledge, it's a RP law and even then, I'm not certain if the HoS actually contacted CC to see if it was fake or not. Etheir way it's at most a fine/brigging and a watching closely. Possessing a gun? Unless you had factual evidence otherwise it was at worst contraband, assuming otherwise isn't your job as warden, your not the detective. Kidnapping is a major crime but unless I killed the person or harmed them it's a twenty minute brigging or whatever.That's also ignoring that you removed my radio (illegal according to my memories of the security guide) without reason, and when you were trying to torture me you shut off my suit sensors (which were on max) after the CMO announced to turn them on. Hm that doesn't sound greify at all, wouldn't want the medbay staff to see you butchering a cuffed prisioner would you. Here's a direct quote from the first sentences of the Warden wiki page: "Half of your job is to look after the prisoners; make sure they aren't abused or given unfair sentences and that they don't escape." Your job is not to enforce justice, not to execute people, not to interrogate or torture them. Your job is to put them in prision clothes, and throw them and their ID and radio in the brig for whatever time provided for their stated crimes and make sure people aren't beating them. Your actions were completely out of character for the warden and completely unfitting of anyone playing security. I promptly demand you be job banned from security till you get your shenanigans together and stop acting like a fool in one of the most serious departments. During a search after your detainment, I ended up finding your two stamps, and after closer examining, found out one could change stamps. ALSO, the whole kidknapping the head of personnel thing? It isn't twenty minutes brigging or whatever. The warden/HoS decides the final time, and considering the issue of the fake-stamp, resisting arrest/assaulting an officer, and the kidknapping, You were to be held for the transfer. As the HoS, I requested the warden interrogate you as there were no others availible, while I went to inform central of the fake stamp (I hadn't known the revolver was a stun one. The officer only said revolve over the radio). All of the above said, I say again, Indy went waaaay to-far.
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